The Interview with Irvin Weathersby, Jr.

Author of In Open Contempt: Confronting White Supremacy in Art and Public Space

Greetings to new subscribers and welcome to Sitting in Silence, an inspirational newsletter and podcast for writers, readers, and thinkers. The interview is a popular ongoing feature of the newsletter. I love talking to writers about inspiration, craft, and life. They never disappoint. So, from time to time, you’ll find these intimate and enlightening conversations in this space. Today’s conversation with Author Irvin Weathersby, Jr.

Irvin is the author of the stellar nonfiction book In Open Contempt: Confronting White Supremacy in Art and Public Space. He is a graduate of the MFA program at City College of New York. It’s such a pleasure to talk to another native of my hometown, New Orleans. I hope you enjoy our discussion.

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And now for today’s interview with Irvin Weathersby, Jr.

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Maurice: What are your earliest memories of reading or writing stories?

Irvin: I recently came across a handmade book, crafted from felt whereby I cut the images then glued them onto the pages which created the effect of silhouettes. Text was written on masking tape and then affixed to the bottom of each page. It was titled "Two's Enough," and I remember it being the period when I asked my parents for a sibling sometime before my eight birthday. The story centers on my imagined brother's birthday. There was rain, toys, ice cream, cake (of course), Nintendo, and a surprise clown. It ended with him happy and worn out. I'm not sure if my parents saw the book and were moved to procreate because of it, but sure enough my brother soon arrived. They even let me name him. The lesson, after reflecting many years later, is clear: stories can help you get busy.

Maurice: Indeed! There's a meme floating around that reading and writing are in the top echelon of what people find attractive in their partners. Also, shoutout to that mixed media format you worked with. It seems that interacting with art was always in the cards for you. Were you the kind of kid to share stories with your friends or did sharing come later?

Irvin: I never consciously considered writing as a boy even though I won a citywide essay contest in the 4th grade. I was more concerned with sports. I didn't grow up in homes with books or with people who yearned for the written word. I know now that reading unfortunately is considered a luxury. You need time and money to consume books. These weren't abundant in my family. The bible was the book I saw read most in my youth. I was, however, moved by hip hop and the poetry that overflowed in our culture. I would study songs and lyrics for hours, dubbing my favorites on 90 minute Maxwell cassette tapes late into the evenings. In high school, I flirted with a rap career, and one of my closest friends succeeded in getting signed with Master P. We would freestyle and write rhymes for hours which I think explains my longstanding affinity for poetry. My favorite rappers were the storytellers, the ones who could transport you to a scene full of emotion and conflict. I knew I wanted to affect people the way they moved me, but I didn't know what that really meant. I had never met a writer nor did I understand how to become one.

Maurice: Same. I had no idea that writers were real people living in the world. I never thought I'd meet one let alone be one. I recorded a lot of cassettes and, later, CDs when I was young. My favorite rappers were the storytellers too: Biggie Smalls, Outkast, Wu-Tang Clan, Tribe Called Quest, and The Coup. Who were your favorite rappers that inspired you to give it a shot?

Irvin: Locally, it was Mystikal, Mia X, Lil Wayne, Juvenile, and Tim Smooth. Nationally, I loved all the names you mentioned, but also Nas, The Fugees, Arrested Development, Goodie Mob, Tupac, Jay-Z, Ras Kass, The Pharcyde, and Ghostface Killah.

Maurice: How did you decide to become an author? And how did you prepare yourself?

Irvin: I've always wanted to work in letters, first as a rapper, like most young men of my generation, and later as a writer with a capital W. I didn't know what it meant when I committed to the vocation in college and became an English major but I knew that I wanted to figure out a way to read and write for a living. I became serious about the calling after teaching high school in Baltimore for a few years. While teaching had its rewards, I knew I wasn't fulfilling my purpose, so I enrolled in an MFA program which was where I gained formal insight into the profession. I met editors and agents and learned about the publishing industry. Most importantly, I learned that I needed to read widely, across genres, always. The diet of a writer consists of at least one book per week, and I try to squeeze in as many as I can. The actual writing then becomes the easy part because I'm never without inspiration.

Maurice: You wrote a beautiful book in In Open Contempt. I admire the breadth and scope of the work, the way you travel the land and give context to the art you encounter. It's such an ambitious concept. How'd you think of it?

Irvin: Thank you! I wrote this book because I hadn't read it before, and I knew that I wanted to do something different, something abstract but also palpable, something that defied definition and more akin to a work of art. I like to think of it as a bricolage wherein each essay informs the whole but can be viewed individually for its own beauty. It's memoir, history, cultural criticism, travelogue, and manifesto at once. Think of a Basquiat painting with all its symbols and colors and words sharing space on the same canvas, offering a glimpse into the inner workings of his mind. That's what I wanted. While wholly original, his work was still grounded in humans, and he situated them and their circumstances within his repository of art history. He responded to his time and those before him in a language that became his own. So with his genius in mind, I sought to recreate the poetic power of Claudia Rankine's Citizen, the emotional weight of Jesmyn Ward's The Men We Reaped, the New Orleanian singularity of Sarah Broom's The Yellow House, the wandering curiosity of Teju Cole's Open City, and the dogged inquiry of Imani Perry's South to America. There were certainly other voices that inspired me but these were the principal ingredients to my gumbo; the roux was me, meaning my interiority and love of art.

Maurice: It's a fearless book in that it engages with the encountered art on so many levels. For example, yes, there's an almost ekphrastic response to each piece, but there's also the anger. What was your method of engaging with the emotions, which I feel would have been left out of most other books on the topic.

Irvin: This is something that I struggled with because I didn't want it to be too sentimental. But then I realized that the affective response was what I was after. I didn't want it to read like an academic text with a distant, removed voice. I wanted to illustrate the importance of letting your body respond viscerally to art because it's such an important part of the experience. We don't move in the world without pathos. This isn't journalism or reported non-fiction. This is a human engaging with the world around him and sometimes the world makes us angry, so why take it out. I didn't remove the humor and sadness and other emotions either. To do so would have been disingenuous. As much as possible, I wanted to recreate the full human experience.

Ultimately, it's about striking a balance on the page. My editor helped me realize when I should pull the emotions back and when I should lean in.

Maurice: I'm glad you left your full self in. What do you want to do in the future as an author?

Irvin: Like all my favorite authors, I want to write everything: drama, poetry, even screenwriting. I've only published essays, and of course, a memoir in essays. I'm working on a novel now and it's going well. Because each of these forms influence me, I can't imagine not exploring them all. There was once a time when I thought I would solely occupy the space of poetry. Thankfully, I grew out of this myopia.

Maurice: What brings you joy?

Irvin: The easy answer is the laughter of my kids. There's nothing like it. Travel is a close second; experiencing other cultures gives me so much energy and perspective. But I'm going to say Black spaces that are unapologetically for us and by us. I'm thinking of the HBCU experience or the Essence Fest or the Zulu Ball or Afro-Nation or Oak Bluffs on Martha's Vineyard, really any space where the Diaspora is on display. We were both at the Schomburg Literary Festival this year, and the vibe was electric. It's hard to describe the feeling of being surrounded by your own in the spirit of celebration and community. That's joy, and honestly, often I find myself shedding a few happy tears in these spaces because they make me feel so alive and proud.

Maurice: Thank you so much, Irvin, for sharing your brilliance!